Sunday, May 07, 2006

Jews support illegal immigration

During the British mandate, many Jews entered "Palestine" illegally. That illegal immigration is even celebrated in a museum.

http://www.jewishuniverse.net/travel/index.php?articles_ID=82

Shockingly, many American Jews seem to side with the nativist anti-immigrant camp in the United States. That is perhaps the best example of American Jews forgetting that we are in galut. We are at the mercy of the (mostly) non-Jewish governments wherever we are in the diaspora. Even countries that were good for us for centuries can become hostile very quickly -- see Germany in 1096 for an example. It is in the interest of Jews everywhere to have open borders throughout the world.

9 Comments:

Anonymous malachai said...

Most immigrants today come for economic reasons, not fleeing persecution and extermination like the jews did. Also, america is overcrowded, our current population is poluting the planet to it's destruction, do you really want an america with a population density approaching china's by century's end? Can we absorb a billion chinese, a billion indians, and billions others? Do you enjoy being shoved into subway cars, or sitting for hours in rush hour traffic suckin up toxic fumes? how about our unaffordable housing? How about working 12 hour days, 7 days a week just to survive? This is the world immigration is bringing us, it is a horrible future for our children. The charedi lifestyle is becomming increasingly attractive compared to that of western civilization, and that may be a big reason why so many jews are moving tword the chariedi and rejecting the modern.

6:41 AM  
Blogger Charlie Hall said...

'america is overcrowded'

Not true. Much of the northern midwest and Alaska have population densities below one person per square mile -- back in the 19th century, that would have been considered beyond the frontier.

Regarding being shoved into subway cars, the current population of New York City is essentially the same as it was in 1950. The suburbs have sprawled out of control, but that is a result of conscious policy decisions on the part of the free market worshipers who didn't want to enforce reasonable zoning restrictions or build reasonable public transit, not immigration.

7:39 AM  
Anonymous jdub said...

charlie,

I'm not sure I agree. Every state has the right to control its borders. The US has the right to say that it will let in a certain number of immigrants per year, distributed across the world, and according to predetermined criteria (e.g., certain visas for specially qualified individuals, other, more general visas for unskilled labor).

Controls on immigration ensure that (1) we're not letting criminals into the country and (2) that we can help ensure that each group will be appropriately assimilated. Massive illegal immigration helps ensure that the groups never assimilate. In my (non-NY) neck of the woods, there are neighborhoods where it's essentially a third world, every store is Latino-oriented, each house has 10 cars (all junkers) parked in front.

Don't get me wrong, I'm pro-immigrant. Pro-legal immigration. I don't think anyone has the right to sneak over the border and say "I'm here and I'm not leaving, nyah, nyah, nyah."

And your argument about galut fails, since we have Israel as a fallback.

8:07 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"It is in the interest of Jews everywhere to have open borders throughout the world."

This strikes me as a bit simplistic. Do you not believe that there are certain groups outside of America that wish to do us harm?("Us" can be read as referring to Americans or Jews.) Should we simply close our eyes and ears to that because "We like open borders" makes for a more pleasant-sounding bumper sticker?

- Moishe Potemkin

8:52 AM  
Blogger Charlie Hall said...

'Do you not believe that there are certain groups outside of America that wish to do us harm?("Us" can be read as referring to Americans or Jews.)'

True. But they aren't Mexicans, who are the group the nativists are really upset about (and who comprise the majority of the current illegal aliens). The last Mexican to conduct a terrorist attack in the United States was Pancho Villa, in 1916.

10:18 AM  
Blogger Charlie Hall said...

'that we can help ensure that each group will be appropriately assimilated.'

Why must immigrants assimilate? I've been reading polemic after polemic about the horrible problem that assimilation is for Jews. Isn't it a double standard to say that we can stay separate but everyone else has to accept the ways of the majority?

10:21 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I'm not defending nativists (that would be the ultimate in hypocrisy, given my non-native nature), but the fact that some of them may have negative traits is not relevant to the merits of their arguments. I personally think, for example, that John Kerry is the emptiest politician I have ever encountered. But that doesn't mean that his opposition to steel tariffs is incorrect. (Of coursen he likely has no consistent position on steel tariffs, but you get the point. Besides, I do get a singular pleasure in whomping on John Kerry. I think he is the emptiest politician...

- Moishe Potemkin, libertarian extremist, and likely Hillary voter. Go figure.

6:14 PM  
Anonymous malachai said...

Charliehall - new york's population is now higher than ever, countint illegal immigrants, although it is only by several hundred thousand, but the metro area is about 10 million people more than it was 50 years aga. While some states have very low population densities as you say, their are no jobs in those places, they are not even very habitable. If we were to direct future immigrants to montana, i would not mind, but the reality is that they will come to the most populated parts of the country and make it extremely miserable for those of us who were born here. Again, do not have the capability to bring in a billion chinese, a billion indians, a billion africans, and a billion others, we are already in excess of our carrying capacity, we are polluting the planet to it's destruction with just 300 million americans.

9:31 PM  
Blogger Goy Guy said...

"During the British mandate, many Jews entered "Palestine" illegally"

And many Jews, one a very close relative of mine, entered legally. So what?

"It is in the interest of Jews everywhere to have open borders throughout the world"

Hmmm...I imagine that would include the Israeli border also? I suppose you have no problem with just letting any Palestinian teenage kid and his home boys just drive over the border on a Saturday night have a couple of beers, chat it up with all the pretty Jewish girls, maybe look for a part time job?

"Even countries that were good for us for centuries can become hostile very quickly"

I suppose that's true. So if you're Jewish and you look to a strong Israel as a safe haven you had better be darn sure they finish that big concrete wall. I look at America as MY safe haven and we'll be starting OUR wall any day now. All Americans were once immigrants. I say "welcome aboard". Just don't sneak in here.

8:20 PM  

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